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#21 PEBlood

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Posted 22 October 2007 - 03:20 AM

Ray, an occupation list is a GREAT idea for more reasons than you list. Sure, it might save time to pick Agricultural laborer from a drop down list, but there are many other possibilities.

If occupation was on a drop down list, you could create a report for occupation frequency, you could generate a report listing the number of farmers, tavern owners, ministers, right down to piano tuners. I have done this manually (below) and it takes hours.

A complication is that you will need a naming convention for some occupations. For instance, do you want to list agricultural laborer separately or together with farmers. For that matter, I personally would want to group farmers, farm laborers, husbandmen and planters together. Do you list shoemakers and tanners together?

Another complication is that in our colonial days, many public offices and committees were held that were unpaid. I do not see those as occupations per se but some might.

Below is a report that I created MANUALLY just for my direct line ancestors. You can see how the drop down list would be complicated by similar occupations or occupations known by multiple names.

Peter

OCCUPATIONS IN MY FAMILY (BY FREQUENCY)
87 Farmer, husbandman, planter, farm laborer
16 Housewright, shipwright, carpenter, nailer, thatcher
15 Shoemaker
15 Mariner/merchant
14 Tailor, Clothier
12 Tavern/innkeeper
11 Miller owner or operator (grist, saw, etc)
10 Weaver, Wool comber, draper
10 Minister
9 Fisherman
8 Blacksmith, ironworker, cooper
7 Civil Engineer, Surveyor
6 Laborer, Painter, hired hand
6 corporate workers
5 Lawyer, Judge, Justice of the Peace, politician
5 Midwife, Nurse
5 Doctor, surgeon
5 Cattlemen, rancher
5 businessman, non-mariner merchants, salesman, speculator, feoffe, property manager
4 Clerk
4 Cabinet or Piano maker
4 Butcher
2 Vintner (wine merchant)
2 Tax Collector, Bailiff
2 piano teacher
2 Officer/commander
2 Musician
2 Factory worker (silk mill, etc)
2 Ferryman
1 Teamster
1 Teacher
1 Station agent
1 Social worker
1 Sculptor, Jeweler
1 Salt Boilry Owner
1 Quartermaster
1 potter
1 lumberman
1 Journalist
1 Glassmaker
1 Basket maker
1 Baker
1 Affeeroor


#22 landbrake

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Posted 22 October 2007 - 06:49 AM

QUOTE(PEBlood @ Oct 22 2007, 04:20 AM) View Post

Below is a report that I created MANUALLY just for my direct line ancestors. You can see how the drop down list would be complicated by similar occupations or occupations known by multiple names.

.
.
.
1 Basket maker
1 Baker
1 Affeeroor


Might I be so bold as to ask what in the world is an "Affeeroor"? blink.gif biggrin.gif

#23 PEBlood

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Posted 22 October 2007 - 07:09 AM

An affeeror makes sure that people pay the fines imposed by Court. The guy who did this died in 1524.

#24 landbrake

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Posted 22 October 2007 - 07:37 AM

QUOTE(PEBlood @ Oct 22 2007, 08:09 AM) View Post

An affeeror makes sure that people pay the fines imposed by Court. The guy who did this died in 1524.


Thanks for the info! I learn something new every day! That's one of the (many) great aspects of doing genealogy research.

Have a great day!

#25 John James

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Posted 22 October 2007 - 09:14 AM

QUOTE(PEBlood @ Oct 22 2007, 02:20 AM) View Post


If occupation was on a drop down list, you could create a report for occupation frequency.......




Cause of death is also a very useful field to understand frequency and statistics within families.





#26 Glenn

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Posted 22 October 2007 - 03:38 PM

While there are many programs available, the one I like best is ShortKeys - http://www.shortkeys.com/

I, too, am an enthusiastic user of ShortKeys (which I learned about on the message boards over at Ancestry.com.) Learning to use it was actually fun because I was trying to keep keystrokes down to a bare minimum.
Example: I have a lot of family in the city of Long Beach CA, and I try to be consistent in a three-level place name (city, county, state), so one of my earliest ShortKeys was LLC. Enter "LLC" and the program returns "Long Beach, Los Angeles, California".
The fun thing to learn was not to use a combination of letters that you might find in the middle of a word. So now most of my short keys begin with the slash "/". I also use short keys in my computerized checkbook. That program/application can be found at www.add-ins.com/easychbk.htm
After create a new short key, you can edit it, delete it or disable it. For example, I also have family in the city of Los Angeles, so I could create another "LLC" for "Los Angeles, Los Angeles, California", keep the "LLC" for Long Beach, but disable it while I was concentrating on the City of L. A.

Glenn


Good real estate may be based on location, location, location;
but
good sources are based on citation, citation, citation!


Glenn


#27 PEBlood

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Posted 23 October 2007 - 02:51 AM

There was some interest in my occupations list, so I thought I would re-analyze my database and post the results again because I have twice as many occupations as before. The relevancy to the original post is that this list gives anyone trying to design a drop down list an idea of how occupations could be grouped. There are of course problems associated with an occupation list.

ISSUES TO CONSIDER

When grouping, I chose to group similar occupations together, like tanner, cordwainer, shoemaker, and leather sealer. However, I chose to separate them if there was a class distinction, such as fisherman vs. sea captain; or factory worker vs. mill or iron works owner.

About 1/5 of my ancestors had multiple occupations. Some had as many as four occupations. I saw some pretty bizarre combinations (e.g. farmer, lawyer, shoemaker). I know that programming multiple field drop down lists are much more complicated then single pick lists.

"Merchant" is a vague term. I chose to separate merchants into sea merchants and mariners vs. businessmen and other traders.

I chose to list only paid professions. This list does not include titles (like yeoman) or public offices (like fence viewer or surveyor) unless the office was paid. Thus most of my surveyors are not counted but a few professional surveyors are.

MY LIST OF OCCUPATIONS

Below are occupations for 504 of my direct-line ancestors for whom I was able to identify occupation. The numbers preceding the occupations are frequency. FYI, I am the one white collar worker at the end of the list.

156 Farmer, husbandman, planter
25 Leather worker (shoemaker, cordwainer, tanner, leather sealer, glover)
24 Mill owner or operator (grist, saw, etc)
22 House wright, shipwright, carpenter, nailer, thatcher
22 Tavern/innkeeper
20 Businessman, businessman, non-mariner merchant, salesman, speculator, feoffe, trader, trapper
20 Mariner/merchant
18 Weaver, Wool comber
16 Minister or Priest
16 Tailor, clothier, mercer, draper
14 Fisherman or rigger
11 Factory worker, foremen
10 Laborer, Painter, hired hand
9 Lawyer, Judge, JP, politician
8 Surveyor
7 Blacksmith, ironworker
7 Cattlemen, rancher
7 Doctor, surgeon
6 Clerk
6 Cooper, barrel maker
5 Butcher
5 Cabinet maker, joiner, piano maker
5 Midwife, Nurse
4 Civil Engineer, bridge builder
4 Musician
4 Teacher
3 Ferryman
3 Ship owner
3 Shipwright
3 Tax Collector, Bailiff
2 Basket maker
2 Military commander (professional)
2 Post master
2 Shoreman, beach master
2 Soap maker, ashery worker
1 Affeeroor
1 Baker
1 Barber
1 Beekeeper
1 Beer brewer
1 Carriage driver
1 Copper mine owner
1 Flax spinner
1 Glass maker
1 Gunsmith
1 Inventor
1 Iron works owner
1 Journalist
1 Lumberman
1 Maid
1 Maple syrup maker
1 Oyster harvester
1 Potter
1 Quartermaster
1 Rent collector
1 Rope maker
1 Salt Boilry Owner
1 Scribe
1 Sculptor, Jeweler
1 Shepherd
1 Social worker
1 Train station agent
1 Stone mason
1 Truck driver
1 Whaler
1 White collar professional


#28 PEBlood

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 02:11 AM

I would prefer a drop down list like the one I created and posted, but your idea would work too and woud be easy to program.

#29 John James

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 08:42 AM

QUOTE(raylong @ Dec 24 2006, 08:49 AM) View Post

I would like to see a new list added to the database for Occupation. I must have typed in Agricultural Labourer over 100,000 times



After reading this old post again and in the light of many others I have a slightly different view.

Up until now (as we don't know what V4 will contain) fields like occupation, cause of death etc (description fields) have been database notes fields and therefore not indexed so starting the problem.

I believe in order to satisfy everyones needs and behaving rather like autocomplete, it would be nice to have the ability to link an external list or table to these and maybe other fields.

This would allow each user to build a custom list if whatever they prefer in whateven language they prefer and have it linked for look up to whicheven description field they prefer.




#30 JohnG

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 10:34 AM

QUOTE(John James @ Nov 17 2008, 08:42 AM) View Post

After reading this old post again and in the light of many others I have a slightly different view.

Up until now (as we don't know what V4 will contain) fields like occupation, cause of death etc (description fields) have been database notes fields and therefore not indexed so starting the problem.

I believe in order to satisfy everyones needs and behaving rather like autocomplete, it would be nice to have the ability to link an external list or table to these and maybe other fields.

This would allow each user to build a custom list if whatever they prefer in whateven language they prefer and have it linked for look up to whicheven description field they prefer.

This makes better sense than an included list that would be unwieldly at best and probably not address everyone's needs. It could also be autoincrementing - every time I add an occupation to an individual and it is not contained on the list, it would be automatically added and available for use when I add the next person.

The extrernal list, the responsibility of each Genealogist, not Bruce & Company, would be more concise and easier to manage.
JohnG

#31 John James

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Posted 18 November 2008 - 06:19 AM

QUOTE(JohnG @ Nov 17 2008, 09:34 AM) View Post

This makes better sense than an included list that would be unwieldly at best and probably not address everyone's needs. It could also be autoincrementing - every time I add an occupation to an individual and it is not contained on the list, it would be automatically added and available for use when I add the next person.

The extrernal list, the responsibility of each Genealogist, not Bruce & Company, would be more concise and easier to manage.



Agree John, I see it working more like a custom spell check dictionary where it would throw up some choices close to what you have entered and give you the option to ADD or CHOOSE