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New Pargraph in narrative reports.


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#1 NEreswearcher

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 10:47 AM

I am attempting to clean up all my output from RM7 and I have run into a question that I thought was on the forum but I don't see it now.

 

When printing a narrative report I have the option of having all the facts for a person come out as a continuous stream of characters or I cn select new paragraph after each fact, etc. When saving the report to an rtf format the output seems to not be the same as the option would infer.

 

If I bring the rtf into a word processor (MS word) and display all the control characters I see:

 

(Paragraph symbol)

First Generation

(Paragraph symbol)

(Paragraph symbol)

1.  Sir Std Fact Types "Stdy" Smith Esq was born on 1 Jan 1900 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Birth Note He was adopted on 2 Jan 1900 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Adoption note He was christened on 3 Jan 1900 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Christening note Stdy emigrated on 1 Jan 1904 from Poland at 50 Main St.. His destination was the USA via Germany He was educated  between 1919 and 1923 at University of Michigan, 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan  earning a BA in history. He was described as dark haried and about 150 # on 1 Jan 1920 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Description note Stdy graduated on 1 Jun 1923 at Ysilanti University at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. He graduated MagnaCumlaude with a degree in electrical engineering He was ill on 1 Jan 1930 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan.  early onset osteoporosis On 1 Apr 1944 he was a  ship welder at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. his extensive traing got him the job Stdy immigrated on 1 Jan 1945 to North Carolina at 50 Main St.. to take a job at Research Park He lived at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan on 1 Jan 1948. in an old historic home He owned a dutch colonial on 1 Aug 1948 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. The property plans are listed here. Stdy retired on 1 Jan 1958 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Retirement note He died of cardiac arrest on 2 Jan 1960 at the age of 60 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Death Note He was cremated on 3 Jan 1960 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Cremation Note Stdy was buried on 4 Jan 1960 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Burial Note He signed a will on 31 Jan 1960 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Will Note He had his estate probated on 1 Feb 1960 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. His will was probated and left the following: Personal Note for Stdy

(Paragraph symbol)

 

 

If I select new paragraph after every fact I get:

 

(Paragraph symbol)

First Generation(Paragraph symbol)

(Paragraph symbol)

(Paragraph symbol)

 

1.  Sir Std Fact Types "Stdy" Smith Esq was born on 1 Jan 1900 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Birth Note

He was adopted on 2 Jan 1900 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Adoption note
(new line)
He was christened on 3 Jan 1900 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Christening note
(new line)
Stdy emigrated on 1 Jan 1904 from Poland at 50 Main St.. His destination was the USA via Germany
(new line)
He was educated  between 1919 and 1923 at University of Michigan, 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan  earning a BA in history.
(new line)
He was described as dark haried and about 150 # on 1 Jan 1920 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Description note
(new line)
Stdy graduated on 1 Jun 1923 at Ysilanti University at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. He graduated MagnaCumlaude with a degree in electrical engineering
(new line)
He was ill on 1 Jan 1930 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan.  early onset osteoporosis
(new line)
On 1 Apr 1944 he was a  ship welder at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. his extensive traing got him the job
(new line)
Stdy immigrated on 1 Jan 1945 to North Carolina at 50 Main St.. to take a job at Research Park
(new line)
He lived at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan on 1 Jan 1948. in an old historic home
(new line)
He owned a dutch colonial on 1 Aug 1948 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. The property plans are listed here.
(new line)
Stdy retired on 1 Jan 1958 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Retirement note
(new line)
He died of cardiac arrest on 2 Jan 1960 at the age of 60 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Death Note
(new line)
He was cremated on 3 Jan 1960 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Cremation Note
(new line)
Stdy was buried on 4 Jan 1960 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Burial Note
(new line)
He signed a will on 31 Jan 1960 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Will Note
(new line)
He had his estate probated on 1 Feb 1960 at 50 Main St. in Kalamazoo, Michigan. His will was probated and left the following: Personal Note for Stdy(Paragraph symbol)

(Paragraph symbol)

 

It appears that RM knows what a new paragraph is but uses a new line after every fact when a paragraph character after every fact was requested.

 

Formatting in a word processor without the Paragraph character presents many problems

Am I seeing this correctly and is there a way to fix this? 
 

P.S. disregard the actual names etc. as this was just a test and the control characters did not show up when copying to the forum.
 



#2 kbens0n

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 01:31 PM

It appears that RM knows what a new paragraph is but uses a new line after every fact when a paragraph character after every fact was requested.


The Book Options choice(s):

New paragraph after every fact *MEANS* each fact will appear in paragraph form (depending on document width) as separated Facts.

New paragraph after facts with notes *MEANS* Notes can be included in those paragraph-form separated Facts.

The key is how much text encompasses each Fact sentence (and accompanying Note(s) if the third option). Thusly, a blank line 

between Facts with or without Notes [in paragraph form, if the text wraps to next line]. What you see in RM's Narrative report preview is what you get (WYSIWYG). At least for me in Word 2010.


---
--- "GENEALOGY, n. An account of one's descent from an ancestor who did not particularly care to trace his own." - Ambrose Bierce
--- "The trouble ain't what people don't know, it's what they know that ain't so." - Josh Billings
---Ô¿Ô---
K e V i N


#3 NEreswearcher

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 02:18 PM

kbens0n,

 

The question was not how the data would be separated  when it comes out of RM but what control characters that it use to achieve the effect. A new paragraph ( Dec 182 ) is not a new line / line feed character ( Dec 10 or . hex A). An rtf file with a new paragraph code should be ( Dec 182) not a new line ( Dec 10). Word processors treat those two control character differently and they will not format the new line the same as a paragraph thus rendering the capabilities of a word processor useless.

 

Example: If you want to indent the first line of every paragraph word 2010 does not recognize what RM is putting out as a paragraph



#4 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 03:13 PM

For my purposes, the difference between a new line symbol and a paragraph symbol in RM's RTF files has not been a problem because I have not done anything with my reports where the distinction makes a difference. If you do need the paragraph symbol in all cases, you could do a global replace of the new line symbol with the paragraph symbol from within Microsoft Word. With the symbols displayed, simply do a global replace of ^| with ^p. My concern would be that there might be some new line characters that should remain as new line symbols and which should not be replaced with paragraph symbols.

 

For historical reasons - like that RM's support of each fact beginning with a new line is new - I don't use any of RM's formatting options for paragraphs. Instead, I put a carriage return character at the front of most (but not quite all) of my sentence templates. As I said, they become new line symbols in the RTF files and for my purposes that has not been a problem for me. However, I do understand that sometimes the distinction between a new line symbol and a paragraph symbol can make a huge difference.

 

Jerry

 



#5 NEreswearcher

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 03:28 PM

Jerry,

 

Some good suggestions but by your answer I assume that RM does not make a distinction between new line and a paragraph in their reports other than what I have already found so I guess I will need to adjust accordingly perhaps using some of your suggestions. It seems like it would be a simple change for RM to allow us to select which character to use and then insert the selected character as they do now with the new line.

 

I have not tried it but is it possible to insert a real paragraph marker into my own sentence structures?

 

For now I will get back to cleaning up my own data and see if RM8 makes a difference.



#6 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 14 July 2020 - 08:47 PM

I don't know of a way to insert a real paragraph marker into an RM sentence template.

 

Jerry



#7 robertjacobs0

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 11:47 AM

Alt-0182 will enter the pilcrow in an RM sentence template, but LibreOffice, at least, doesn't operationalize it. But I would think (haven't tried it) that a search & replace in Word would enable one to substitute a working paragraph marker for the pilcrow.

 

¶  :)



#8 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 12:05 PM

Just out of curiosity, I just now added the pilcrow to an RM sentence template as Robert described. What's being added is really the character pilcrow, not the action desired from a pilcow. So the RTF file created by RM contains the character pilcrow, not the action desired. Using Microsoft Word I went into RM's "reveal codes" mode and globally replaced the pilcrow character with ^p, which is Word's code for the actual paragraph action. It seems to work fine.

 

In all truth, you could use any character in RM's sentence templates that's absolutely unique rather than using the pilcrow. Then replace that character in the RTF file with the ^p action, and it should be fine.

 

Jerry



#9 NEreswearcher

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 01:01 PM

Robert & Jerry,

 

Thank you for the suggestions.

 

I tried this out and I was able to get a symbol that looked like a paragraph mark into the narrative report but when looking at the resultant RTF file I see the following codes for that new symbol:  \'b6\loch\f0 

 

When inserting a paragraph mark in word 2010 I get this code in the file: \par

 

Definitely not the same and Word does not recognize the RM inserted alt-x0182 as any kind of a control sequence however it does display the paragraph symbol.

 

I guess the best solution at this time is to follow your advice and format my output as best I can or insert a unique code for an RM paragraph and do a global change in word. I've looked at my copy of FamilyHistorian 6 and it does not do any better at formatting output. A possible chance for RM to get ahead?



#10 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 01:51 PM

I actually do two levels of editing RM's RTF files before printing. Some of the editing I do with Notepad++, a powerful text editor. That's because some of the global replaces I need to do are easier with Notepad++ than with Word. Then I do the second level of editing RTF before printing with Word itself. The last thing I do before printing is to highlight each index and rebuild the index with F9 in Word. That's because the editing will change the pagination of the document and therefore will invalidate the page numbers in the index.

 

Jerry



#11 NEreswearcher

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 05:12 PM

Jerry,

 

I also use notepad to do some of my editing but as of now based on what I see in notepad and all the control characters I think I will do my best in RM and then work on the rest in Word. So far that has worked as well as I can expect. There are many changes that need to be completed in Word since we only get a single image exported with each person and I have many more photos to add and place so I will only do that when I am satisfied that I have done the best that I can in RM.

 

I have also used PersonalHistorian for some special projects that only seem to work there. I have wanted to tell a complete story of a single family and with RM I select the group of people and export that to PH and then all events are intermingled and chronological which makes telling a story of multiple people much easier.

 

Anyway if we wanted this to be easy we would have selected another endeavor.



#12 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 15 July 2020 - 06:50 PM

I also use notepad to do some of my editing 

 

I was making reference to Notepad++, which is a much more powerful editor than the Notepad that comes built-in with Windows. Which of the "notepads" do you use?

 

By the way,  I still use the much simpler Notepad for simple tasks. But Notepad++ or something like it is sometimes essential for more complex tasks. If you do use Notepad++ or Notepad to edit RM's RTF file, you certainly should do so before editing the same RTF file with Word. The first time you use Word for an RTF file and then do a Save, the file will be radically different than the original RTF file produced by RM, even if you had made no changes to the RTF file with Word before the Save.

 

Jerry



#13 NEreswearcher

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Posted 16 July 2020 - 09:31 AM

I was using Notepad but I also have a hex editor that I got from Microsoft that I sometimes use. I do not ave Notepad++ but I should look into that.

 

I have noticed that Microsoft products in general seem to bloat their output. I have converted several word and excel documents to HTML and they go way out of their way to be a generic fit for anyone but the code is very voluminous so I understand your point about editing before MS gets their hands on the file.

 

I have looked at the other genealogy programs that I have and they don't do any better at formatting than RM. In one of my less lucid moments I even thought of importing back into TMG since they were very robust in this area. That would be a bad move in my opinion. Just fanciful wishing I guess.



#14 Don Newcomb

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Posted 16 July 2020 - 03:04 PM

I remember when RM used virtually no RTF formatting. Book format reports were just streams of text with spaces and new-lines. Was that ever a PITA.