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Sharing RM databases with Apple product users

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#1 Tom Rianhard

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Posted 01 March 2018 - 07:49 PM

I want to share some of my RM databases with remote Apple product users. To the best of my knowledge, iTunes will only allow me to share with Apple devices that can be directly wired to my laptop where I use RM and Ancestry.

One alternative is to use DropBox. As far as I am able to determine, this would require me and my prospective sharees to spend 9.99 per month in order to install and work with DropBox so as to share RM databases. Have I missed something or misunderstood this methodology? 

I already have minimum, free cloud-based storage apps that could be used. Certainly iCloud/iDrive is automatically available to Apple device users.

I also see that the new Files app implies that there is the ability to drag and drop files from cloud-type apps to other apps that cooperate. Couldn't RM be enabled for something such as this?

Thanks

Tom Rianhard



#2 J P

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Posted 02 March 2018 - 02:23 AM

Just a clarification on iTunes transfer. Yes, the iOS device has to be connected by wire the first time, as this makes the device known. However, subsequently, once the device is known, you can use WiFi and do not have to connect it by wire every time. (At some point in the future you seem to have to connect by wire, once, again, as at some stage devices become unknown to iTunes. I have no idea what is the trigger for this loss of knowledge.)

Yes, it would be good for RM to be able to find files on iDrive, as that would make this area much simpler without the need to use iTunes or Dropbox.

#3 Tom Rianhard

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 11:29 AM

Thanks J P! You have reminded me that you mentioned that iTunes would work thru Wi-Fi. Yesterday I ran iTunes without connecting the iPad, and there was no little iPhone icon to the right of the 'Music' button. I did look around for the 'File Sharing' option elsewhere, but could not find it. This leads me to believe that the recent changes to iTunes has changed the WiFi option, among other things. One step forward, one back.

 

One big helping of crow on my plate; I found a different web address for DropBox, and found a free offering for a small slice of cloud storage, 2GB. I have downloaded the install program.

 

How can we raise the visibility of my desire to have iDrive added to the file sharing alternatives in RootsMagic?



#4 J P

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 12:23 PM

Thanks J P! You have reminded me that you mentioned that iTunes would work thru Wi-Fi. Yesterday I ran iTunes without connecting the iPad, and there was no little iPhone icon to the right of the 'Music' button. I did look around for the 'File Sharing' option elsewhere, but could not find it. This leads me to believe that the recent changes to iTunes has changed the WiFi option, among other things. One step forward, one back.


Maybe this is a difference between the Mac and PC versions of iTunes. Just checked on my Mac and iTunes can still see my iPhone and iPad that I connected by cable some days ago.

#5 Tom Rianhard

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 02:58 PM

J P, would you please describe where you see the IPhone and iPad devices in the iTunes window.

Thanks



#6 J P

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 04:05 PM

J P, would you please describe where you see the IPhone and iPad devices in the iTunes window.
Thanks


On the initial iTunes panel, on the top line just below the music controls, there is a pull-down towards the left hand side that offers options of Music, Films, TV Programmes, Podcasts and Audiobooks. To the right of that is a small icon that looks a bit like a small iPhone. If I select that, then I get a list of, in my case, an iPhone and an iPad. These are active on my network but attached by WiFi. (The Mac connects to the same LAN via Ethernet.) Selecting one of those devices, the menu at the left changes to offer information about that particular device. The default panel provides a Summary of the device - serial number, software level and backups, together with various option settings. Moving down the left hand menu under Settings, the options are Summary, Music, TV Programmes and so on, but the last one is File Sharing. That is the panel that allows you to move files to the RM app. Select RM on that panel and you can add files, and they will be transferred. If you want to delete a file, select it and just use the delete key.

Hope that helps.

#7 Tom Rianhard

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Posted 03 March 2018 - 06:42 PM

Thanks again, J P. As you surmised, there appears to be a difference in functionality between your iTunes and mine. When I disconnect the wired iPad, the little iPhone-like icon disappears. It doesn't reappear until I rewire the iPad.

 

After I reran iTunes, I selected the iTunes Help button on the menu bar at the top. Then I selected the 'About iTunes' option at the bottom of that dropdown list. The pop-up window allows some info to scroll up from the bottom. It shows the following information: iTunes version 12.7.3.46

 

What does your information show?



#8 J P

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 05:49 AM

Thanks again, J P. As you surmised, there appears to be a difference in functionality between your iTunes and mine. When I disconnect the wired iPad, the little iPhone-like icon disappears. It doesn't reappear until I rewire the iPad.
 
After I reran iTunes, I selected the iTunes Help button on the menu bar at the top. Then I selected the 'About iTunes' option at the bottom of that dropdown list. The pop-up window allows some info to scroll up from the bottom. It shows the following information: iTunes version 12.7.3.46
 
What does your information show?

12.7.3.46 - so the same.

Maybe this is something to do with Bonjour - a protocol that is used on the LAN to broadcast awareness of Apple devices and services. As I understand it (vaguely), this is installed on Windows when iTunes is installed. I gather that it can be problematic on Windows and people often remove it. Assuming you havent done that and it is actually running in the background, perhaps it just isnt working properly. I assume a wired iPad is found via other means, but maybe not.

#9 Tom Rianhard

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Posted 04 March 2018 - 11:18 AM

Peeling the layers of the proverbial onion!

 

My iPad connects to my Surface via the USB port on the Surface. The iPad power cable allows the electric plug to be removed, leaving a USB connector for the Surface. There is no LAN so I guess that Bonjour bid me Au Revoir.

 

Letting no good deed go unpunished (sort of), this further underscores my requests for the addition of iDrive as connective tissue between my PC and the Apple devices that I want to share with, most specifically the iPad across the room.



#10 Rooty

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Posted 24 November 2018 - 07:46 PM

1. In itunes you must choose the phone icon on the top right to get to the summary screen. Then scroll down to options and click sync with this phone over wifi in the future. Syncing is slow compared to a usb connection.

 

2. dropbox has 2 gb free storage and you can earn more but why not use icloud and share the appropriate file. Google share icloud file for details. Apple gives you 5GB free and more space is quite cheap.



#11 Tom Rianhard

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Posted 25 December 2018 - 09:04 PM

I want to continue and expand on this topic that I started.

 

My long range intent would be to share database files with others in such a way that they would be independent of my dropbox (or other) sharing approach. To explain this differently, I would want remote users to be able to load a copy of a database from cloud storage into a regular or 'essentials' version of RM on a apple device, and these users would be able save the database to their device, locally, disconnect from my cloud storage, and still have access to, and 'own' the database.

 

Is there a way to do this, or is something in development to enable this?

 

Thanks!

 



#12 TomH

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Posted 25 December 2018 - 09:50 PM

As just another user, I cannot speak to what is in development. Only MacOS users can run the full or essentials RootsMagic app. iOS users can only run the read-only app from the Apple Store. The latter looks for the database in the Dropbox folder; if you have ruled out Dropbox for file sharing, then you have ruled out iOS users. That leaves only MacOS users to serve and that should be easy. You could use iCloud or any web server and not require them to install anything like Dropbox, Google Drive, One Drive... Upload your RM backup file, get the link to it and allow anyone with the link to access it. Send the link to them by email so they can download the file and restore database and media files from it to their systems.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#13 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 26 December 2018 - 06:38 AM

I'm a long term paid Dropbox user. But I started with a free Dropbox account. I would only reiterate what has been stated earlier in this thread that a free Dropbox account should be ample for your purposes. Just don't put anything in your free Dropbox account except for your RM database(s). Neither you nor anybody you are sharing with should have to pay anything for such an account.

 

Jerry



#14 Tom Rianhard

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 10:35 AM

Thank you, all, for your responses.

 

For the time being, I accept that Dropbox is the only game in town, and that 2MB is available at no charge.

 

I want to be able to send a copy of a RM database to people with an iOS device, who are not close enough to me to make travel a realistic alternative. I would like to have the database be stored on their iOS device, since there might be circumstances when they might be reluctant to access the internet in non-secure places, and therefore not have access to Dropbox. What would be the solution. As I understand it, the iOS based RM cannot 'save' the database to local storage in the iOS device. I have looked at and tried the new iOS 'Files' app, but have not seen where the RM app stores its on-device databases.

 

In addition, when using the new 'Files' app, I can see that it has access to such storage apps as OneDrive, iDrive, Box and of course Dropbox. I would like to see the RM storage space be opened to this storage app. Can this happen?

 

Thanks!



#15 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 12:51 PM

I should clarify that your main RM database probably would not be in Dropbox. Rather, whenever you want to update the RM database on your IOS device, you first COPY your main RM database to a folder at C:\Users\user\Dropbox\Apps\RootsMagic\ where "user" is replaced by the username you use to logon to Windows. I think there may be other ways to do it, but this way works for me.

 

Then, install the Dropbox app on the IOS device and install the RM app on the IOS device.The Dropbox app will sync the RM database on the IOS device with the RM database in  C:\Users\user\Dropbox\Apps\RootsMagic\    The RM app on the IOS device will then use either the most recent copy of the RM database that it knows about or will get a more recent copy from the Dropbox app. The IOS device really doesn't have to be connected to the Internet to use the RM app, provided you are willing for the RM app to use the most recent copy of the RM database that it knows about. There is more than one way to do it, but this is what works best for me.

 

Your case will be very simple. In my case, I have tens of thousands of files in my Dropbox, and in a certain sense all of those tens of thousands of files sync between my Windows computer and my IOS devices. Except that Dropbox doesn't fully sync all the files it contains with an IOS device like it does with Windows devices. Rather, Dropbox works in a "just in time" mode on IOS, and only does the sync on a one file at a time basis, and only when you try to use the file on the IOS device. Only a very few of those tens of thousands of files in my Dropbox are actually on my IOS device at any one time. So if you are going to be using a Dropbox hosted file on your IOS device, you need to be sure to sync that particular file while you have Internet access, even if later you are going to be using the same file on the IOS device at a time the IOS device does not have Internet access.

 

Jerry

 



#16 Rooty

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Posted 30 December 2018 - 12:59 PM

Tom;  

1. send your rootsmagic file to people using either email or one of the free send large files websites.

                  Apple Mail drop, Firefox send, wetransfer, pccloud. Google these to learn more.

2. they can connect their ios device to their computer and access the file through itunes. Even a crippled windows pc should handle this.

             Click the phone/pad icon->summary item->file sharing->rootsmagic app.

3. If you have these files on ancestry you could share them and they could perhaps see them with ancestry's free ios app.