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Ability to directly edit spreadsheet "People" tabbed view

People Tab Tabbed View Editing

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#1 WandererOTD

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Posted 29 March 2015 - 06:48 PM

Displaying the "People" tab is an extremely powerful way to view the contents of an RM database, either as a whole or by using named groups.  Since it can be sorted and customized to show various important fields, it gives the user the capability to critically examine the data in ways not otherwise possible.  This (for me, anyway) has showed me many (etc.) ways that I need to update the data in one or more people. 

 

At present, editing this spreadsheet view is not possible, and one must double click to bring up the individual's record in order to make an edit (think make a change or add to a specific field/fact).  It would be SOOOOOOOOOOOOO much easier if I could simply click in a field and be able to change what data is reflected there - without having to go into the person's record by double-clicking.

 

Thanks for considering this idea.



#2 Laura

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Posted 29 March 2015 - 10:36 PM

This has been asked for before, I think

It takes one click to chamge to the Timeline main view which can be edited, and, one click to go back to the People screen.

#3 WandererOTD

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Posted 29 March 2015 - 11:06 PM

Indeed you are correct - one click to "Timeline" which is editable.

 

However, "Timeline" shows you only 1 person while "People" shows you everyone (all, or the group you've selected). 

 

If "People" view (spreadsheet) could simply allow editing in the cells presented (instead of them being read-only) then the user could see a "real time" picture of the data against others in the group of interest. 

 

"Timeline" view is ok, but it is 2 extra steps (in, and out) and IMHO less intuitive.

 

That probably means it is much more programming and therefore something of an issue.  This is a wish list, after all.



#4 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 30 March 2015 - 09:23 AM

This is an interesting thread. It parallels a recent discussion about RM's Edit Person screen, where the screen looks much like a spreadsheet but where the cells are not editable and where you can't just "add a row".

 

I absolutely love People View despite it's restrictions. In addition to the limitation of its cells not being editable, another perhaps more subtle limitation is that only one row may be displayed for each person. This limitation comes into play when there is more than one  event for a particular fact type for a person. The primary case where this limitation comes into play is with the census fact type where a person might have been enumerated in the 1940 census, the 1930 census, the 1920 census, and so forth back until their birth. I have resolved this problem with People View by using user defined fact types for census - one fact type for the 1940 census, one fact type for the 1930 census, etc. The approach of using user defined fact types for census events makes People View become very useful for processing census data instead of being very useless for processing census data. The approach of using user defined fact types for census events also makes makes RM Explorer work much better for census events for finding, marking people, making groups, and color coding. (Disclaimer: there is still a minor glitch with this approach in the relatively unusual situations where the same person was enumerated two different times in the same census.)

 

Other fact types can occur multiple times as well, for example multiple birth or death events if there is disputed data. I try to avoid multiple events in these cases by documenting the disputes in notes rather than with multiple events. I still struggle with the best way to handle multiple burial events in the case of re-interments.

 

A person having multiple marriage or divorce events would be a problem for People View except that People View doesn't support family events. I really don't understand the reasoning behind not supporting family events in People View.

 

Jerry

 



#5 Renee Zamora

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Posted 30 March 2015 - 10:53 AM

Confirming enhancement request is in our tracking system.

 

Jerry mentioned some good concerns about having the list editable because you can't see all the facts of the same type. I can think of several more reasons. But here's my main concern.

 

If that list were open edit it would be very easy to click in a spot and accidentally overwrite a field. I've seen this happen with Google spreadsheets I share with others. They go to search the file and instead overwrite the last cell they were in. If you have to click on a name in the People view in RootsMagic and start typing to move to a different person, wouldn't you in effect erase a name if it was open edit?  This would need to be taken in consideration. The option in that case would be to no longer have predictive searching. To me I would much rather have predictive searching capabilities then to edit directly in the People view. If you say well don't let us live edit names you still have the concern of accidentally writing over the other fields.


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#6 WandererOTD

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Posted 30 March 2015 - 11:37 PM

There are many ways to make that list "editable" that make it harder for the user to accidentally delete data.  I think the programmers would be able to make it work.  If there were a problem with the type-ahead searching, that could be dealt with.  Perhaps forcing a double-click in a particular cell to enable editing?  Make type-ahead not functional until the user safely exits a cell?  All possible.

I have begun to use the People view as a giant to-do list on screen, especially since I can add fields (facts) to view, and can restrict it to specific named groups or everyone as I choose.  

I created new facts ("D-Cert', "SSDI", "SS-5", and "Obit" with description only.  I changed the People view to show those new facts.  Now, with a custom group, I can examine groups for what needs to be done.  Using it, I can see holes in my data, and derive research direction from it.  

Knowing what I don't have within a certain specific population (user-defined list) is very helpful.

I can also take this data with me in a custom report I built that has Name, M-F, Death Date, <.......the new facts.....>, and Buried Location.  The report is "generic" in that it can take any custom list - and it becomes a research worksheet.  I can then annotate the printed worksheet, then come back to the computer and update the fields I have resolved with collected data.  I can then also clear the NO field and make it a YES.

Then I somehow (right now I'm doing it manually for immediate ancestors) create these facts in each (relevant) person, and insert "YES" or "NO" answering the question whether or not I have these things.  If no, I need to get or do them.  If yes, no problem.

With the custom report, I can use a user-defined list of people who died in a specific region, state, city, etc.  Using this custom report, and the user-defined list, I then get a report that amounts to a hit-list of work to do in a genealogy field trip.  Or research that's needed in the overall genealogy effort.

Of course, once I get some particular item done, I want to change the NO to YES.  That's one additional area that the in-cell editing of the PEOPLE tab would be really very helpful.

So the in-cell editing would benefit me for all the ways previously discussed in this thread, plus reducing a tremendous amount of work filling in the yes and no answers.

Of course, I have to figure out how to (==easily==) initially get those user-created facts into the pertinent records in the 1st place.  The end-product (new use of people tab and custom report working together) seems to be a really nice tool.
 



#7 Laura

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 12:29 AM

So what is your next step, Jerry?

Are you then going to open the person's Edit person screen or change to the Timeline view and add the actual data you found to it's place in the person's record and add the source?

#8 WandererOTD

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 12:49 AM

Laura -

 

Who were you addressing your question to?  You asked it to Jerry - but did you mean it to be a question to me?

 

Thanks.

 

Fred



#9 Laura

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 01:42 AM

Sorry, yes, I meant it for you. It is late and I didn't pay enough attention.

#10 Vyger

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 04:16 AM

Jerry mentioned some good concerns about having the list editable because you can't see all the facts of the same type. I can think of several more reasons. But here's my main concern.

 

If that list were open edit it would be very easy to click in a spot and accidentally overwrite a field. I've seen this happen with Google spreadsheets I share with others. They go to search the file and instead overwrite the last cell they were in. If you have to click on a name in the People view in RootsMagic and start typing to move to a different person, wouldn't you in effect erase a name if it was open edit?  This would need to be taken in consideration. The option in that case would be to no longer have predictive searching. To me I would much rather have predictive searching capabilities then to edit directly in the People view. If you say well don't let us live edit names you still have the concern of accidentally writing over the other fields.

 

Whilst I am all for improvements and productivity I have to agree with the concerns regarding direct edit of the People View. By its very design the People View will always be a partial view of information even if drop downs were incorporated to facilitate multiple facts and I would always prefer to edit data in the context of the full data available for that person.

 

Jerry raises the subject of multiple facts citing census searching which is a very desirable goal not easily achieved within the present functionality of RM, that is a modern need that really needs addressing but better discussed on a specific thread. Jerrys idea is a good and one that I will incorporate now and can easily back out of at a later date but the mass of users could not so census researching is a particular need which I believe deserves further discussion.


Keeping ones customers and their important views at a distance is never a good approach

 

User of Family Historian 7.0.7, Heredis 2021, Rootsmagic 7.6.5

 

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#11 WandererOTD

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:50 PM

Laura asked: Are you then going to open the person's Edit person screen or change to the Timeline view and add the actual data you found to it's place in the person's record and add the source?

 

Fred's response: Entering data which requires sources requires (IMHO) a full user screen.  Or the Timeline view.  So I'd want that under that scenario.  Entering YES or NO in flags and re-sorting data alphabetically according to flags (another benefit of the spreadsheet view) doesn't require the same thing, and I'd only need (and prefer) the spreadsheet view for that purpose.