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Webinar on Roots Magic 7


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#1 gerwally

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Posted 03 December 2014 - 08:00 AM

When will the Webinar on what's new in Roots Magic 7 be uploaded to the site for viewing?



#2 Don Newcomb

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Posted 03 December 2014 - 12:19 PM

I would like to watch it again to see if maybe I missed something and I, maybe, don't need to be as concerned as I am.



#3 Laura

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Posted 03 December 2014 - 05:59 PM

The video is now on YouTube, RootsMagjcTV.



#4 Holm D T

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Posted 03 December 2014 - 07:04 PM

Will it also be available for download on the RM webinar page?



#5 Happy

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Posted 04 December 2014 - 11:01 AM

I watched the webinar this morning and have a question about the new backup/restore process.

 

When you restore a file that was backed up with media to the same computer it was backed up from, and restore it with media, where do the restored data base media pointers point to for the media; the original location or the restored media folder?

 

Henry



#6 Renee Zamora

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Posted 04 December 2014 - 01:13 PM

I watched the webinar this morning and have a question about the new backup/restore process.

 

When you restore a file that was backed up with media to the same computer it was backed up from, and restore it with media, where do the restored data base media pointers point to for the media; the original location or the restored media folder?

 

Henry

 

If you restore the backup that contains media you have an option to restore just the backup or the backup and media. If you actually restore the media to the computer again it will place them in a folder under the same folder the database is restored to. But, now the media links will link only to that one media folder. It will not put the media back in the folder structure you previously had. All those links change to that one media folder. So don't restore your media along with the backup if you don't want that to happen. 


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#7 zhangrau

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 12:09 PM

[Renee said:
It will not put the media back in the folder structure you previously had. All those links change to that one media folder.]

Huh? Why wouldn't the backup & restore process maintain the folder structure? When I archive files and folders using WinZip it stores and recreates the folder structure. RM should also be able to do this.



#8 Renee Zamora

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 11:27 AM

[Renee said:
It will not put the media back in the folder structure you previously had. All those links change to that one media folder.]

Huh? Why wouldn't the backup & restore process maintain the folder structure? When I archive files and folders using WinZip it stores and recreates the folder structure. RM should also be able to do this.

 

The biggest use we could see for this feature was to help users move to a new computer. In those cases it wouldn't necessarily be possible to maintain the folder structure found on the previous computer. The other consideration was users receiving backups from others they are working with. In that case it would be easier to have them all contained in one folder, allowing the user the option to reorganize them. 


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#9 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 12:52 PM

 

The biggest use we could see for this feature was to help users move to a new computer. In those cases it wouldn't necessarily be possible to maintain the folder structure found on the previous computer. 

 

I would never use this feature to move to a new computer because of the loss of folder structure. And I can't think of any reason why it wouldn't be possible to maintain the same folder structure found on the previous computer. Well, a high level folder name might be different on the new computer or something like that, but changing the high level structure doesn't have to change the relative structure of the image files relative to each other. Indeed, WinZip has the ability to restore to a different high level folder while maintaining the same folder structure of all the files in the zip file being restored.

 

I sort of get the benefit of making a single large folder to send to another user, but I still wouldn't do it that way. I would want the other user to get the benefit of my folder structure.

 

My take on this feature is that it's really not all that new. Rather, it's sort of a re-purposing of the Sharable CD feature. The way the Sharable CD feature handles media files is exactly the same way - make one big folder out of them and lose all of the original folder structure. It was a pretty weak design then, and it's still a pretty weak design now.

 

Jerry



#10 Renee Zamora

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 01:06 PM

The question was why it does what it does?  It sounds more like you want an enhancement request with the option to preserve the original folder structure. I am confirming that enhancement request is in our tracking system. 


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#11 TomH

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 01:54 PM

A risk from the consolidation of all media files into one folder is that there may be two files having the same name but different content in separate folders. What happens in the backup? Is there then only one file having the content of the last one backed up? Does the backup rename files with duplicate names? If so, is that tracked in the database. I have been meaning to do a test but no time...


Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#12 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 03:46 PM

A risk from the consolidation of all media files into one folder is that there may be two files having the same name but different content in separate folders. What happens in the backup? Is there then only one file having the content of the last one backed up? Does the backup rename files with duplicate names? If so, is that tracked in the database. I have been meaning to do a test but no time...

 

In the case of the Sharable CD, both files are kept and the RM Express on the Sharable CD points to the correct file in each case. The duplicate file names get version numbers - (1) or (2) or something like that at the end of the name, I can't remember the details. I've seen other programs and WIndows itself doing the same thing. I don't know if this "multiple files with the same name" thing is formally supported by Windows, or if it's just something that a few programs do.

 

I'm guessing that the new RM backup process for media files is using the same code that is used for making Sharable CD's.

 

Jerry



#13 Laura

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 07:53 PM

Since Media Gallery was introduced, only one media file with the same name is linked to the database so there is now only one copy of s mwdia file with the same name in a Sharable CD.



#14 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 08:36 PM

Since Media Gallery was introduced, only one media file with the same name is linked to the database so there is now only one copy of s mwdia file with the same name in a Sharable CD.

 

Well, yes and no. RM does not prevent adding additonal media files with the same name which are stored in different folders. Perhaps it should, but it doesn't.

 

I just did the following test. I made a new database containing one person. I tagged two different files of the same name from two different folders to the one person in the database. In this particular case, the name of the file was 146.jpg which isn't very meaningful. RM tagged both of the files just fine and both of the files are visible in Media Gallery, including their distinct file paths. I then made a Sharable CD, and both files are on the Sharable CD and properly linked to the one person in the database. One of the files is called 146.jpg on the Sharable CD. The other file is called 146(2).jpg on the Sharable CD. So there is no real conflict at this point in the processing, and RM does accept files with the same name from different folders just fine.

 

However (and there is a huge however), the Fix Broken Media Links tool will be totally confused by multiple files of the same name in the Media Gallery. So it's a pretty severe no no to have multiple files of the same name in Media Gallery.

 

Jerry



#15 Laura

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 07:46 AM

Thanks, Jerry,.

 

 I probably didn't experiment with having same name files in different folders as I abandoned that practice years ago when using Family Origins.



#16 Vyger

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 09:15 AM

The question was why it does what it does?  It sounds more like you want an enhancement request with the option to preserve the original folder structure. I am confirming that enhancement request is in our tracking system. 

 

With the greatest of respect to all involved it's not an enhancement request but a lack of forethought in the introduction of the feature, if users immediately say "why can't I?" that is a miss on Rootsmagics part not a good idea for the future.

 

Rootsmagic is littered with such missing logic that then become enhancement requests never to be fulfilled. Such simple research needs to be carefully completed before introducing any such feature rather than leaving it unfinished for version after version, a longer beta test to complete functionality would go a long way.


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#17 TomH

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 09:40 AM

From Backup Media with Database - RAR:

 

 

Here is a one-click backup procedure that stores the database file and all the media files it references in one solid, compressed backup file, preserving the path to each. Many have lamented the fact that RootsMagic 4 neither stores images in its database file nor backs up media files together with the database file so that all the files can be transported together between drives, computers, cloud storage, etc. A workaround is to follow the procedure Create a Shareable CD and zip the collected files found in its temporary folder prior to burning the CD but this has proven cumbersome, slow, the folder hierachy is collapsed and multiple links to the same media file result in as many copies.

 

From Backup Media with Database - 7Zip:

 

 

Not everyone wants to pay for an archive utility as much or more than the price of RootsMagic alone, especially when RootsMagic already includes an archiving engine that, with a few tweaks, could do the job. So here is a full database + media procedure that uses a free backup program7-Zip AND produces a .rmgb archive/backup file containing both a RootsMagic database and the media files it uses. And the really good news is that the RootsMagic Restore function will unpack the archive to a folder where the media will be in the same relative folders as they were in at the time of archiving. If this target folder path is different from the path of the original database folder, all that's needed to correct the now erroneous media links in the database is to use RM's Search & Replace on Multimedia filenames. So c'mon RM! It should be a trivial task to add a full backup feature to the File menu...

 

It only took 44 months from when these were published to get the workaround...


Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.