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New RM, Old issues


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#1 Leah

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 09:30 PM

This issue, reported and added to the bug tracking system two years ago, still does not seem to be fixed in in RM6
http://forums.rootsm...ces-not-nonored

This issue, reported and tracked over a year ago, still does not seem to be fixed in RM6
http://forums.rootsm...rivate-alt-name

#2 Paul Harris

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 10:22 PM

Sad, isn't it? Over the last year I don't recall anyone clamoring for any of the 'new' features, save, perhaps, "Find Anywhere." But like you, I have watched many serious shortcomings and problems entered into the Tracking System that don't ever seem to get the developer's attention. Sorry, but the Emperor has no clothes. I have reservations about the future of this product.

#3 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 10:28 PM

Unless I've just missed it, the promised list of items fixed in RM6 has not yet appeared. I'm sure the American Thanksgiving holiday is a major reason, and I hope the list of fixes appears soon. I love the new features, but I personally have not been able to find any bugs that have been fixed.

Jerry

#4 Ludlow Bay

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 11:58 PM

Why won't Bruce just come clean once in awhile and give us the truth about our wishes? Does he really believe that we are being pacified by the in-but-never-out tracking system? If it weren't such as serious slap in the face to the users, it might be considered the biggest joke ever foisted on the genealogical community. It would seem that Bruce has forgotten that those who use the product are the ones who elevate it to a great product. Pretty cocky attitude for someone who needs us more than we need him.

#5 MVS

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 03:28 AM

Could not agree more. So many issues that have been requested for so many years across major releases.

I seem to remember a thread on this forum a couple of years ago where we were told that there were more requests coming through from individuals outside the forums than in them. So if we are unhappy - how many others are in our position posting requests, reporting shortcomings and bugs and seeing them go into the "black hole"?


MVS.,

#6 Paul Harris

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 06:32 AM

I would suggest a boycott on the Wish List forum. I can't see wasting the keystrokes and bandwidth, anymore.

#7 Ludlow Bay

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 10:48 AM

I would suggest a boycott on the Wish List forum. I can't see wasting the keystrokes and bandwidth, anymore.


A boycott on purchasing is the only action that will produce results.

#8 TomH

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 01:28 PM

If it is true that more requests come through outside the forums than from them AND if it is true that the number of requests has some sway over Bruce's attention, then I would suggest that a letter-writing campaign be mounted. Okay, e-mail. Or support request forms.

One of the side-effects of the public forums is that if a bug or wish is well presented once, the rest of us sit back and think, well done, well said, I like that - and that's the end of it. Submitting bug reports and enhancement requests solely privately means that others are unaware of the submission and may submit the same thing; ergo, more requests from outside the forums. We all have a lazy streak and also don't want to clutter up the forums with "Me, too!"'s. So maybe we should be following up the forum discussions, which I would not want curtailed, with individual direct action.

This message board system also has a polling function that could be turned on, or, alternatively, an external polling service could be used to measure the level of interest in some feature or concern about some bug. I would be impressed if there could be an improvement in the connection between what is said in the forums and what comes out of development.

Sadly, we appear to be going through the now very predictable cycle of reaction to a new version. Initial excitement, flurry of bug fixes related to the new features, frustration over long outstanding bugs and requests left untouched, followed by grudging acceptance that that's the way it is, more or less, until the RootsMagician decides its opportune to milk the cow again.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#9 Ludlow Bay

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 09:02 PM

... AND if it is true that the number of requests has some sway over Bruce's attention ...


I don't know that there is any evidence of this being the case.

Sadly, we appear to be going through the now very predictable cycle of reaction to a new version. Initial excitement, flurry of bug fixes related to the new features, frustration over long outstanding bugs and requests left untouched, followed by grudging acceptance that that's the way it is, more or less, until the RootsMagician decides its opportune to milk the cow again.


Ain't it the truth.

#10 APerson

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 12:51 AM

Here's an error that I reported nearly two years ago (December 2010). While it's a very small one, it would take all of three seconds to fix. Specifically, there is a punctuation error - my original whine is located here:
http://forums.rootsm...county, +state)

Renee also confirmed that it was an error and that it had been added to the tracking system. BTW, I first noted the problem in RM4, complained about it again a year ago, and it's still there. Could someone please fix it? Please? Pretty please?! :D

#11 Ludlow Bay

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 01:37 AM

Maybe they need a tracking system to keep track of the tracking system.

#12 Vyger

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 02:29 AM

IMHO, polling system yes but bombarding support I would feel may be counterproductive.

Maybe those Beta testers out there should be the filter between the forum and support and once a problem is verified it should be well presented direct to support. Being Beta testers I would like to believe those requests get a higher priority and get fixed quicker than just board posts.

Now Beta testers are very unlikely to be on the pay roll of RM but I would hope there would be enough of them out there for at least one to be online each day, like a volunteer support group. B)

We are all limited by our visions and abilities

Whilst we can borrow from the visions of others we cannot always deliver.

 

User of Family Historian 6.2.7, Rootsmagic 7.6.0, Family Tree Maker 2014 & Legacy 7.5

 

Excel to Gedcom conversion - simple getting started tutorials here

 

Root


#13 MVS

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 05:04 AM

I see today from the Forums that there is a person reponsible for development fo the new Rootsmagic online publishing system. Now I do not know whether this person has worked full time on it or part time but we must presume that a fair amount of work went into it. And the person makes it clear that there are "future developments" to come.

My question is - "why" ?!!

I cannot recall seeing any great demands on the Forums from people to have yet another way to publish their family trees online There are already plenty of methods either through chargeable systems like Ancestry, or free boards. I would imagine that the majority of RM users already subscribe to one or more of these facilities anyway.

So why is priority given to develop something outside of the core system, currently has no security, and which is readily available elsewhere? Especially when there are all the outstanding requests for features to be completed, bug fixes to be resolved, standard windows features to be implemented (like remembering window sizes) and other inconsistencies to be sorted.

There seems little hope...........

MVS

#14 alansogd

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 11:03 AM

Oh, ouch guys, I'm standing *right here* :P

I'm going to go ahead and give a disclaimer right now that I am talking as a person and not representing the opinion of the company. I'm not important enough to represent the company anyway.

I have worked mostly full time on the online publishing system for the last couple of months, but before that have been involved in a variety of other Internet/Web tasks as well (migrating the forum/blog to a more capable server, doing some work on the website, etc, etc). As such, I don't usually work intimately with the core development team, so while I have tried to be open about my work, I can't answer a lot of your questions that are outside my area.

I can say that the forums don't necessarily represent the average user, especially those of you who have been here a long time. You guys are the "power users", and there's nothing wrong with that, but there's a large demographic of our users who are thrilled about the online publishing system because the prospect of setting up a website themselves is very daunting, even if it seems easy to you. My point is that this is not a random, "because we can" feature. It was just requested by a different demographic than we tend to see on the forums.

Unfortunately, "milking the cow" is part of business. Nobody here is sleeping on a big pile of money surrounded by beautiful women (or, at least, they haven't told me about it), and for RootsMagic to stay viable, things have to be added that make the most people want to buy it. That's reality. I'll concede that I agree with some of your complaints. I prefer a company culture of openness -- which is why I am spending some time on the forums -- and I'd be thrilled if I could steer the company in that direction, but I am limited by my position. However, you have to understand that from the position of the company, shiny, new, easy-to-use features will pay the bills more than fixes for bugs that affect a very small group of people. I suspect that the desktop team has good intentions, but that inevitably, new issues pop up and these old ones that never get resolved keep getting pushed back as being "less important" than bugs that have more serious consequences or affect a larger group of people.

I do think that communication about the status of reported issues could be a lot better, but please take a step back and look at this thread from the perspective of a developer like me. This forum is absolutely poisonous sometimes, and I have read more consistently negative diatribes about our company and products here, on our own hosted forums, than anywhere else on the web. And while I have been praised for my attempts to be open about my work, here I'm basically accused of being useless, redundant cruft to a failing product. I can ignore this, but you can't blame any developers who would much rather forget that the forums exist than try to work closely with them. They'd be wearing a bacon suit into PETA headquarters. I imagine the silence from developers and the negative environment in the forums developed side by side, but at this point both sides need to make an effort to change if any positive communication is going to happen here.

I can't blame anyone here for being negative about the lack of communication, nor can I blame any developers for wanting to avoid the forums. However, I do think it is a problem, and when it is in my capacity to encourage open dialog I will do so. I hope that for your part, you can make an effort to be less condescending and more constructive in your criticisms, and on my end I can work with Renee to help the forums become valuable and relevant again.

Thanks, everybody. Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go add Tetris Simulator support to the websites :P

#15 Ludlow Bay

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 11:12 AM

Thank you for your candor and remarks, all right-on-the-mark. Unfortunately, as you said, your comments don't represent the company :(

#16 Vyger

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 11:42 AM

Very candid and, in my opinion, very true

We are all limited by our visions and abilities

Whilst we can borrow from the visions of others we cannot always deliver.

 

User of Family Historian 6.2.7, Rootsmagic 7.6.0, Family Tree Maker 2014 & Legacy 7.5

 

Excel to Gedcom conversion - simple getting started tutorials here

 

Root


#17 TomH

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 01:43 PM

I think positive feedback for Alan's efforts at participating in the forum will go further than continued grouching about the past. I am disappointed, however, that active forum members might be regarded as a fringe element of the much larger RootsMagic user community but I'm not surprised; I tried to start a user group in my locale and found that all of the participants are but occasional users of the software and have barely scratched the surface of it. It would be unfortunate for us if that was the main target market. When I used the phrase "milking the cow", it was not intended to be disparaging but rather an observation that the company needs to drink from time to time to stay alive. I wish that Bruce's mission was to deliver the best possible genealogy software in the shortest period of time to the widest market but also recognise that measured growth in the product and market may be the best long term hope for his own and the company's financial security.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#18 kbens0n

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 05:25 PM

alansogd You have reached your quota of positive votes for the day ≡÷þ


---
--- "GENEALOGY, n. An account of one's descent from an ancestor who did not particularly care to trace his own." - Ambrose Bierce
--- "The trouble ain't what people don't know, it's what they know that ain't so." - Josh Billings
---Ô¿Ô---
K e V i N


#19 Ludlow Bay

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 07:18 PM

You have reached your quota of positive votes for the day


Actually, this seems to be a bug in the forum software. I've never hit the Like button before in my life, and I just got the same message. The way I read it, it isn't saying that Alan has reached his quota, but that I have reached mine. If it is implying that there is a limit to the number of people who can vote each day, or a limit to the number of votes a person can receive each day, the error message should be fixed.

#20 TomH

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 09:07 PM

The limit is 0, I.e., the Like function is effectively disabled.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.