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#21 Nettie

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 07:18 AM

You are describing an Access database which has a template for each contacts, issues and/or a projects databases. Includes the items you are describing. I have used the issues one for creating a 150th celebration at a church. Which will work for what you are talking about. I do not see RM doing this for a while. Outlook for 2007 has a contacts database that will work with an Access one.

Bygones and Clooz 3 are other possible choices.... I know you are making a suggestion, but ......

Genealogy:
"I work on genealogy only on days that end in "Y"." [Grin!!!]
from www.GenealogyDaily.com.
"Documentation....The hardest part of genealogy"
"Genealogy is like Hide & Seek: They Hide & I Seek!"
" Genealogists: People helping people.....that's what it's all about!"
from http://www.rootsweb....nry/gentags.htm
Using FO and RM since FO2.0 


#22 Serenity20061

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 09:11 PM

Thank your for your suggestions. I have looked at Clooz and other genealogy research tracking software applications. The problem with most, if not all of them is that they may do a great job at tracking research, but they have a very limited or poor database for the genealogy informaton management.

The end result of my search for the "right" genealogy program is that I can buy a genealogy program that does a great job of storing the results of my research AND/OR I can buy a good program for tracking my research activities. BUT there doesn't seem to be a single program that integrates both the research tracking AND the data management of research results. All the discussions seem to lead to a recommendation for another software application to manage the research tracking side of the equation.

RootsMagic appears to be the closest to making the link between research tracking and research results in the genealogy world. The Research manager is user friendly and easily used to track my research activites, but it isn't well integrated with the data in the records and can't be viewed at the same time as the records themselves. The same thing with the Correspondence log. It may be that the tables on the back end of the genealogy program don't use junction tables or may have a completely different approach to databases. To my very limited understanding of the programming side, it just seemed like a few junction tables could integrate the two sides and create a software program that could handle both aspects of genealogy research.

The end goal would be to have it all in one program instead of needing to go to other software applications or spreadsheets to track the research activity. I don't know about you, but as much as I try to keep it all organized, it is very difficult to keep the entering the same information in multiple programs, and tracking systems (one online tree, one desktop tree, one spreadsheet for tracking research, a paper filing system for original documents, an electronic filing system for media files, and now potentially another software application for tracking correspondence and research activities).

I know it is still probably years away from finding a single program that can do it all in one place (with the exception of the paper files for original documents), but it is my hope that with incremental enhancements to existing applications we might eventually see a fully integrated genealogy software application that can handle the full spectrum of genealogical research tracking and data management activities.

#23 TomH

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 09:31 PM

@Serenity20061, you obviously have an understanding of database design and perhaps also some programming skills. Take a look at the unofficial documentation of the RootsMagic database at the wiki linked in my signature. Maybe you can conceive a bolt-on solution to your needs that could work with the RM database. We would welcome your contribution. I must confess that I have barely scratched the surface of the Research Manager.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#24 Paul Harris

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 09:06 PM

Serenity20061, et al.,

I started this thread some time ago as a Wishlist Item. Since that time I have observed that Wishlist Items go into a Tracking System, but over the last several major upgrades to RM, not much, if anything seems to make its way OUT of the Tracking System and into the program. This observation, along with some other developments, have changed my thinking about integrating research efforts into a genealogy database program. While long wishing it could all be integrated into one tool, I have begun to believe it would be better to separate the two functions as much as possible by performing and documenting the research process in one tool, then entering the SALIENT RESULTS of that effort into your Genealogy Program.

A large part of my thinking about this methodology has stemmed from features that are lacking in RM, have long been requested, but years go by and they fail to appear. As an example, in the program I migrated from I had formed the 'good' research habit of documenting ALL sources of information with citations, regardless of how insignificant or repetitive they might be. I have name variations for an individual that have twenty or thirty citations to every source where their name appeared. I have many events that are 'supported' by ten or twenty citations. However, for reporting and output, I only want to list, perhaps, my BEST three source citations in their order of significance. In my former program I could selectively 'exclude' individual citations from output and I could manually rearrange them in the order I wanted them to appear. This capability does not exist in RM, though it has been in the Tracking System for a long time. So, my options in RM are to include, say, twenty citations for a fact, or none at all. Going forward, I would be better off documenting my twenty sources in a 'research program' and entering just my best three in RM, and, oh yes, make sure I enter them in the 'right' order.

I, too, have looked long and hard at research tools. Bygones was a hard concept to grasp, but once understood it was a decent 'tool.' Clooz 3 has made some progress, but still has a long way to go. I am beginning to focus on a budding product that shows a lot of promise to be on the vanguard of genealogical research tools. It can be used from 'scratch' to build research, or it can import people, places, sources, and a variety of data items. Then you can live link and cross reference almost anything with anything. Create an Assertion and assign Tasks to it. Attach People to the Assertion and the Task, as well as Places, Repositories, Notes, Media. Quite frankly, you can create a 'view' of your research that is very informative and useful. I like to think of this program as Bygones on steroids, but more fun to use. It's complexity might be overwhelming for some, but it is poised to fill a tremendous void in our field.

Paul

#25 Ludlow Bay

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 09:40 PM

I am beginning to focus on a budding product that shows a lot of promise ...
Paul


And that product is .....?

#26 Paul Harris

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 10:40 PM

And that product is .....?


To be announced - - - - soon. It is in the final stages of beta testing and version 1 should be available soon. Yes, I am teasing, because I am looking forward to sharing this information with many people, but have been asked by the developer to hold off just a bit so they are not bombarded with new users until they are ready. I promise I will reveal all as soon as is practicable because I would really like to see some of you power users ring this thing out. We would all benefit greatly.

Paul

#27 Nettie

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 10:55 AM

Also part of that beta team and yes am waiting also.

Genealogy:
"I work on genealogy only on days that end in "Y"." [Grin!!!]
from www.GenealogyDaily.com.
"Documentation....The hardest part of genealogy"
"Genealogy is like Hide & Seek: They Hide & I Seek!"
" Genealogists: People helping people.....that's what it's all about!"
from http://www.rootsweb....nry/gentags.htm
Using FO and RM since FO2.0 


#28 Serenity20061

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 09:18 PM

Definitely let us know as soon as you are able to reveal the name of the new product. I will definitely be one of the first in line to jump in.

I have 35 years worth of genealogical research to compile for a town's 150 year celebration in 2018. Most of this research is still in binders full of family group sheets, photocopies of documents, interview notes, and photos. I have several Excel spreadsheets full of tracking information on records searched and the results of those searches. and still have a lot of research gaps to fill in (especially from my early years of research before I discovered the value of properly citing my sources). Back in the 1980s, I tried some of the early genealogical software applications, but after losing a database with over 10,000 names and all of the information in it (much of the information I am still trying to re-construct) I quit using any genealogical software. Over the years, I have gone through an earthquake, a flood, a hurricane, a house fire, computer crashes, and about 20 moves across country, each with the resulting loss and reconstruction effort associated with my genealogical data. When I discovered Ancestry.com (in its early days), I quickly recognized the value of uploading all of my information into an online tree where my information was stored somewhere offsite. I have used Ancestry.com ever since, but still have a ton of information I just haven't gotten to yet that is still in boxes and binders).

Now that I am in the final 5 year stretch of the 150 book project, it is time to compile all of my research and do some serious data cleanup and report writing. I also still have many gaps in my research that need to be completed and I am going through the daunting task of going through the list of individuals in my tree one at a time and entering all of the information from my binders and then creating task lists of research gaps that need to be filled in before I can write a brief biography for each family. Ancestry.com just doesn't have the reporting tools or research tracking tools that I need to accomplish the task. I also realized that there was going to be no cost effective way to put all of this research into book format. So the idea was to burn the gedcom file to cd so people could load it their family information into whatever software they were using.

So the search for a genealogical software application began about 4 months ago. I started with the logical choice when moving from Ancesty.com and bought FTM2012 because of the "tree sync" feature which was advertised as being a seemless interface. I took the time to read every page of the user manual (several times) to really learn the program features and have bookmarked and tagged pages that I referred back to constantly (something I frequently do with new software). Although the program has a very short learning curve, and has many great features, the list of problems seemed to grow each time I opened the software - not the least of which was that it kept maxing out my CPU at 100% and locking up my computer (an yes, I compacted the tree multiple times in each session). Another shortcoming of the FTM2012 software was the lack of any abiity to group individuals by common data points, families, view women by both their married and maiden names (essential for trying to find links between families), or track my research. So I started exploring other software that could handle my heavy use (between 30-60 hours per week), and had the features that would assist me in compiling all this data and tracking my research. That is when I discovered that just because every program says it can import and export gedcom files - all gedcom files are not created equal and only some of the information will transfer correctly. During the past two months, I have spent more time reading about software programs, playing with trial versions (buying a few so I could test the features not in the demo version), learning about gedcom structures and playing with transferring gedcoms back and forth to try to adapt my data entry habits to ensure that the majority of my data entry will transfer via gedcom across multiple software applications, and cleaning up my FTM2012 tree so that I don't lose all my notes in a gedcom transfer.

In the end, I decided that RM6 was the best fit for my needs. While it lacks a few of the features that I liked in other programs, it has many of the tools and features that I need without requiring years to learn the software. Some of the features that I particularly liked was the ability to color code my index of people by data points, see both maiden and married names in the index, create groups of individuals and then do mass actions for all the individuals within a group, and the ability to have two trees open at one time and drag-and-drop people between the trees.

Paul - you mentioned that you wanted to keep your research separate because of the sheer number of alternate names and multiple sources for each data point. I have the same thing, but I came up with a solution after playing with RM6 that is definitely on my top 10 list of best features in RM6 - the ability to have two trees open at the same time and drag and drop individuals between trees. So now I have a "working copy" of my tree with the long list of alternate names, alternate birth dates, possible family links, research dead ends and successes, and many many notes (some are rants about a particular repository that I will never go to again or a person who contributed a large amount of family tree information that was all unsourced). I even have a few familes in the tree that I spent quite a bit of time climbing only to discover later that a lower relationship link proved to be two different people. So I disconnected the relationship and left the separate branch out there just in case I find another link in later research. The second tree is my "clean copy" of the same tree. I only move someone from my "working copy" to the "clean tree" once I have completed sufficient research to confirm that they should be included and then only move the best source citations and a clean summary of the notes that I am willing to share with others. My "working copy" is for me alone -- when I die, if someone discovers my "working copy" and delves into my research notes in detail, I won't be around to suffer their opinions about the use of colorful language in some of my notes about repositories, my self invented shorthand, my unconventional use of the "suffix" field in names to note relationships or name types so that I can find people in the index, or my personal style of entering source citations (I put a properly formatted source citation at the beginning of my source notes, but create my own free-form source citations in the source window so that I can find things more easily). I may even decide to enter all my place names in reverse order in my working copy because I don't care about conforming to gedcom in my working tree. Yes, it means that when I drag and drop a person, there is a bit of clean-up to do in the source citations, place names, and people names - but I only put information in the clean copy that is "finished" and don't do any research activity in the clean copy. It will be alot easier than trying to move the information from a separate research program.

Thank you for the complement about my programming knowledge, but I promise I am not a programmer. I am more an advanced user of Microsoft Access databases and am really good at using search engines to find what I am looking for. My knowledge of the programming side of databases was a one-time project where I built a small Access database about 7 years ago to track the training completed by sales reps for a medical device company. It took months of reading "For Dummies" level manuals before I figured out that the reason my links between tables weren't working correctly was because I needed junction tables to create many-to-many relationships. That experience gave me a basic understanding of database structure and writing queries to create reports, but by no means am I anywhere close to being able to do programming at the level that current software applications and have no idea what SQL is other than another programming tool for creating databases. A class in C programming during my undergraduate coursework in e-business was enough to convince me that I would NEVER be a programming coder and NEVER wanted to revise C programming again.

I am really enjoying the message boards and the discussions about genealogy program features. I am really learning alot about genealogy programming and different approaches to using software to make some of my compilation work easier.

Is there a message board for giving KUDOS to the tech support department? -- Bruce from the RM tech support team has been extremely helpful in explaining the way tags and sublevel tags are put together for Places in a GEDCOM. FTM2012 merged the description field with the location field into a single PLAC tag. Considering that I have been using Ancestry.com for years and had diligently used the "descripton field" to document every single event and record, the end result was a location list that was a huge mess. I told Bruce that I really wanted to understand how the gedcom was structured so I could fix it myself and learn from the experience. Bruce explained the basic gedcom structure and provided an example of a current improper entry and then an example of how that same event should be properly formatted to separate the description and place fields. Bruce's clear instructions gave me the confidence I needed to edit the gedcom file. He saved me months of time on a time-critical project. THANK YOU BRUCE!!!

Theresa

#29 TomH

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 09:52 PM

Thank you for the complement about my programming knowledge, but I promise I am not a programmer. I am more an advanced user of Microsoft Access databases and am really good at using search engines to find what I am looking for.

You may be surprised at how easy it will be for you to construct useful SQLite queries to examine your database in ways that you cannot using RM, given your understanding of relational databases. Indeed, some of our wiki participants have succeeded in interfacing MS Access to the RM database although I believe there are limitations.

The kudos you express here undoubtedly will reach tech support. Unless there is more than one Bruce, you received help from the big kahuna himself, the RootsMagician, the software architect, chief programmer, director of marketing, cruise leader, bottle washer, jack of all trades, President and owner of RootsMagic Inc.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#30 TomH

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 10:01 PM

Bruce from the RM tech support team has been extremely helpful in explaining the way tags and sublevel tags are put together for Places in a GEDCOM. FTM2012 merged the description field with the location field into a single PLAC tag. Considering that I have been using Ancestry.com for years and had diligently used the "descripton field" to document every single event and record, the end result was a location list that was a huge mess. I told Bruce that I really wanted to understand how the gedcom was structured so I could fix it myself and learn from the experience. Bruce explained the basic gedcom structure and provided an example of a current improper entry and then an example of how that same event should be properly formatted to separate the description and place fields. Bruce's clear instructions gave me the confidence I needed to edit the gedcom file. He saved me months of time on a time-critical project.

I, for one, would be interested in what steps you took to split the Ancestry GEDCOM fields. You might also be intrigued at the work I have done using a combination of the Ancestry GEDCOM and the GEDCOM exported by FTM2012 from a sync'd Ancestry database to bring all the online citation images into RM and create WebTags for every online citation. See Ancestry.com and RootsMagic 5 (also works for 6) and WebTags - from Ancestry.com and FTM.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#31 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 10:49 PM

You may be surprised at how easy it will be for you to construct useful SQLite queries to examine your database in ways that you cannot using RM, given your understanding of relational databases. Indeed, some of our wiki participants have succeeded in interfacing MS Access to the RM database although I believe there are limitations.


I have done a lot of RM queries directly from SQLite, and also I have done a lot of RM queries from Access. Sometimes it's sort of six of one and a half a dozen of the other as to whether using SQLite directly or using Access better meets my needs. But other times, one or the other is clearly indicated and I simply use the tool that's best for the job, i.e., don't use a screwdriver as a hammer or vice versa.

It's easier to get started with SQLite directly if you already know SQL. If you don't already know SQL and if you already know Access, you might be better served by Access. The tricky part with Access is that Access cannot read an RM database directly. Instead, you have to set up an ODBC connection from Access to RM. Doing so is not rocket science and how to do it is described on the Wiki. But it can still be a little intimidating to set up the first time through. The other tricky part is that either using SQLite directly or using Access will inevitably have to tangle with the proprietary RMNOCASE collating sequence that is used within RM. There are solutions for using SQLite with RMNOCASE collation and for using Access with RMNOCASE collation that are described on the Wiki, but you do have to use the solutions if you want to sort text fields. For example, if you are using Access and if you want to do something so simple as sort a bunch of records by last name, the last names won't sort unless you use the solution that's described on the Wiki. It's not that they will sort incorrectly on the SQLite/Access side of the house. They will not sort at all without a minor bit of extra work on the SQLite/Access side of the house.

I initially made a serious attempt to write my SQL in such a way that the same SQL would work directly in the SQLite environment and also in the Access environment. But the SQL dialect that is supported by Access contains so many Microsoft peculiarities that none except the most trivial SQL statements will work in both environments.

Finally, I work very hard not to use SQLite directly nor to use Access. Which is to say, I work very hard to accomplish needed queries from within RM. But I'm constantly running into really simple queries that can't be accomplished at all from within RM and which are extremely easy to do from SQLite directly or from Access. So I keep writing queries outside of RM despite myself. Whether it's SQLite directly or Access, I really like the fact that SQLite directly or Access are running in a completely independent window from RM. RM doesn't support multiple independent windows. So you can be in a query environment such as RM Explorer and you are sort of stuck there. It's a major pain to get back and forth between such environments and the main RM views. But with SQLite directly or Access, I can run a query without losing my place in RM, make some changes in RM, rerun the query outside of RM to reflect the changes I just made without losing my place in RM, make some more changes in RM, etc. For example, the query might be for family members for whom I need to find 1940 census entries. As I enter the 1940 census entries, the people for whom I've just entered the census entries immediately drop off the query with one click. And I don't step all over myself switching back and forth between RM to do the data entry and SQlite/Access to run the queries. It's a really nice way to work.

Jerry

#32 Romer

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 11:27 PM

I, too, wish for research management being better integrated into RM, including a number of the suggestions mentioned throughout the thread.

#33 Serenity20061

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 06:53 AM

The kudos you express here undoubtedly will reach tech support. Unless there is more than one Bruce, you received help from the big kahuna himself, the RootsMagician, the software architect, chief programmer, director of marketing, cruise leader, bottle washer, jack of all trades, President and owner of RootsMagic Inc.


WOW! This is the first time I have ever encountered a software company or ANY company for that matter where the "big kahuna" got anywhere near customer/tech support. It explains why RM6 has such a short learning curve and easy-to-understand user interfaces. When the top dog actually gets into the trenches of dealing with customer/tech support issues, it provides a better understanding of the user perspective. Bruce and RootsMagic has definitely gained a HUGE fan!

#34 Serenity20061

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 07:20 AM

... I work very hard to accomplish needed queries from within RM. ... For example, the query might be for family members for whom I need to find 1940 census entries.

Jerry


Jerry, can you explain how you structured the query to get a list of people using the same source? I have been fighting with this exact same query for two days. I am breaking my 150 year book project down into manageable sub-groups based on the source document where an individual/family first appeared in the town.

The town of Washta Iowa was founded in 1868, so the first census for the town was the 1870 census which contained 278 people in 60 households (actually 277 people, 1 was listed twice). I created a separate 1870 master source for the town to distinguish from my 1870 everyplace else source. I then tried creating a "group" so I could work with this particular sub-set of individuals more easily.

I can't get my query results to come out with the necessary 277 people. My next step is to manually go in and mark each person separately, but I have several individuals with the same name in the index, so it requires looking at each person page to make sure I am marking the correct person in the group screen. (I couldn't find a way to select a particular master source as the data set for the query).

It sounds like you have already found a query structure that will do the job.

Thanks!

#35 Serenity20061

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 07:43 AM

You may be surprised at how easy it will be for you to construct useful SQLite queries to examine your database in ways that you cannot using RM, given your understanding of relational databases. Indeed, some of our wiki participants have succeeded in interfacing MS Access to the RM database although I believe there are limitations.


Tom,
I have joined the SQLite for RootsMagic wiki group (also the BetterGedCom and FHISO groups). It is my first time working in a Wiki environment and the SQL programming language is completely new, so I am off the to bookstore to find "SQL for Dummies", "Wiki for Dummies", "Access2010 for Dummies", and "Gedcom for Dummies" books to educate myself on the lingo and programming code. I look forward to participating. Thanks for the link!

I am also watching for potential career opportunities in the field of genealogy and genealogy software development. My current position will be eliminated next year due to legislative changes in the industry, so looking at is as an opportunity to make the move from a J.O.B. to a career in the genealogy world, which is my true passion. Just starting to explore what is out there, but definitely motivated to learn.

#36 TomH

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 08:17 AM

Good attitude, Theresa! I don't think I have a book on SQL but I cut my teeth on dBase II - maybe before your time ;). There's plenty of on-line stuff and nothing better than messing around with it.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#37 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 10:36 AM

Jerry, can you explain how you structured the query to get a list of people using the same source? I have been fighting with this exact same query for two days.


Typically, I run such a query against the census as a fact rather than as against census as a source. Census can be a fact, a source, or both.

Let's suppose first of all that you want to do it from within RM and don't want to mess around with SQLite directly or with Access. Basically, what you want to do is to run a search using the Find capability from within RM Explorer. Click the magnifying glass on the the main RM tool bar to get into RM Explorer and then Find from the RM Explorer tool bar to get into the Find dialog (the screen actually says Search for Information). The idea is to set up a query for people who were born before 1940 and who died after 1940 (or who are still living) and for whom you do not yet have a 1940 census fact. You will probably also wish hone in further and restrict the search just to a subset of your database - just to descendants of John Doe or just to people born in Missouri or some such.

The Find capability from within RM Explorer is very powerful and useful in general, but it's curiously inept at this particular kind of query. The chief stumbling block is that you need to find people who don't yet have a census fact for 1940, and you try to say something like "census date not equal 1940" and it finds people who have a census fact with a date of 1930 and 1920 etc., even if they also do have a census fact for 1940.

So you don't really do a query as I have just described above because there is no way to get it to work. What you need to do instead is to use the Mark/Unmark dialog from within RM Explorer. To do so, you need to create a Named Group of the people without a 1940 census or you need to color code the people without a 1940 census entry. So instead of starting with the Find process, you start with the Create Named Group process (it's in the Group sidebar) or with the Set Color process (under Tools). In either case, you will want to go to "People selected from a list" where among other things you will see "Mark Group" and "Unmark Group". The dialog will initially have everyone in your database unmarked. From there, you might for example Mark Group for the Descendants of John Doe, Unmark Group for people whose birth date is after 1940, Unmark Group for people whose death date is before 1940, and Unmark people for whom Census date is equal 1940. This last (unmarking people who already have a 1940 census fact) is a trick that works in Mark/Unmark but which doesn't work in the basic Find dialog. Once you get into Unmarking, you can keep unmarking based on various categories of information until all that's left is the people for whom you really want to find 1940 census entries.

Having color coded, you can then use the Find dialog to find by color the people you just marked (assuming you used a unique color). Having created a named group, you can place the Named Group into the Group Sidebar and/or filter by the Named Group in the People View. In the case of color coding, you will find only those people for whom you need to find a 1940 census entry. In the case of Named Groups, you will only see those people for whom you need to find a 1940 census entry. As you find and enter the appropriate 1940 census facts, neither the color coding nor the Named Group will adjust themselves automatically to reflect that you have now found the 1940 census entry. This is a capability that is frequently called Dynamic Groups (and by analogy migh be called Dynamic Color Coding for colors). This capability does not yet exist in RM, and it is much Wished For. So you periodically will want to redo your color coding or rebuild your Named Group for people who need a 1940 census fact.

From SQLite directly or from Access, the approach is to look directly in the RM tables. I formulate a query based on a JOIN of the Name Table and the Event table. The Name table has the birth and death dates available in an easy to process format, and also includes the names of the people and their RIN numbers. The Event table includes all those things that we see in RM screens as individual facts such as birth, marriage, death - and yes, census facts. Unlike with the Find capability in RM Explorer, it's very easy to formuate a query directly against the RM tables that identifies which people do or don't have a 1940 census entry. I will run an SQLite Manager or Access in a separate window at the Windows level and go back and forth between my query and RM. As I add 1940 census facts to RM, I can do a one click refresh of my query in the separate query window to see who is left still missing a 1940 census fact.Which is to say that the one click causes the query to run again, it typically runs in less than a second, and those people for whom I have just found a 1940 census entry drop out of the query.

Jerry

#38 Alfred

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 11:46 AM

Jerry, can you explain how you structured the query to get a list of people using the same source? I have been fighting with this exact same query for two days. I am breaking my 150 year book project down into manageable sub-groups based on the source document where an individual/family first appeared in the town.

I must be missing something because I would get a list the easy way, using RootsMagic itself.
Lists - Source list - select the source - Print - uncheck most of the options, but leaving Citation Details checked.
Save it to a file.
Alfred

#39 TomH

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 12:37 PM

I think we have answers to two different questions:

1. List of people lacking a Census fact for a given year but likely resident there.
2. List of people with fact citations sharing a common Census source.

I'm not even clear what the question is as Theresa has expressed it more or less both ways. Maybe the goal really is:

3. List of people with a Census fact for a given year but citing a general Census Source that needs to be replaced with the specific Washita Census Source.

For that, SQLite is calling out to be used to replace the general Census SourceID in the CitationTable with the Washita SourceID for those citations for those Census facts whose Place is Washita. SQLite would be finished the task for the 277 persons in less than a second.

Tom user of RM7550 FTM2017 Ancestry.ca FamilySearch.org FindMyPast.com
SQLite_Tools_For_Roots_Magic_in_PR_Celti wiki, exploiting the database in special ways >>> RMtrix-tiny.png app, a bundle of RootsMagic utilities.


#40 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 01:28 PM

I must be missing something because I would get a list the easy way, using RootsMagic itself.
Lists - Source list - select the source - Print - uncheck most of the options, but leaving Citation Details checked.
Save it to a file.


I perhaps answered the wrong question.

As Alfred says, getting a list of census citations from RM is straightforward (or getting a list of any citations from RM is straightforward). My only quibble is that the way you have to get lists of citations does not result in what is becoming known as a "live report" nor is it very easy in general to use RM Explorer to explore citations.

Getting a list of people who are missing a census fact for a particular year is not straightforward, and that is the question I was trying to answer. If the question is getting a list of people who are missing a census citation for a particular year, then I think that also is not straightforward. I did try to indicate that census can be a fact, a citation, or both. I focus on census as a fact because I want census transcriptions to be front and center in narrative reports.

Jerry