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PLACE DETAILS - management and reporting


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#21 Vyger

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Posted 27 January 2012 - 12:04 AM

The 5.0.2.1 update today transfers notes, latitude and longitude and media from the place to the place detail when splitting places.

Which is where it was originally intended, this could easily have been overlooked but was spotted and fixed very quickly.

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#22 MVS

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Posted 27 January 2012 - 02:38 AM

I agree with Jerry (c24m48) that a totally automated way of splitting Place into Place Details is beyond hope, however when RM moved from Version 3 to 4 and Place Details became available I wrote (with the help of others) a VB programme that "suggested" the correct splits. It used a database I quickly scraped off various web sites of UK, USA and Australian Town and County names and another table of country names to aid it. By finding the placing of the Town and/or County within the Place data it could make a pretty good guess as to which part was the Town/County/Country bit and which part was the Place Details. It enabled me to convert about 3000 entries in a few hours and ever since then I have not had the issue to worry about.

It is probably a bit late now but I think perhaps the people who matter (RM developers) might in future, when they have need to change the database structure, give a little more thought to the task the Users are set with to achieve all this.

When I think of the presumably tens of thousands of Customers who are having to go through the thousands (perhaps tens of thousands) of Place details to manually split ALL of them - and compare that to the perhaps few days development effort that was needed to provide some sort of semi-automatic conversion utility.......a few days work against perhaps many MILLIONS of hours of Customer time.**

(** Calculation based on the wildest of guesses of 2000 Places in a database and 100,000 customers being able to tackle 2 splits a minute manually - comes to 1.6 Million hours - you can put your own guestimates in for number of customers and number of Place records in a typical database and how quickly you can split a place ( Oh - and if I put in a minimum labour rate in the UK of 6.08 that comes to 10 million pounds of labour).


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#23 Renee Zamora

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Posted 27 January 2012 - 01:16 PM

If you want a report for events in just one instance of place details, I was not able to find it. On the other hand, it may not be important. Exporting the results to a [.rtf] file and then doing selective edits would achieve the desired results.

Confirming enhancement request is in our tracking system.
Renee
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#24 Vyger

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Posted 27 January 2012 - 02:56 PM

..... the Rootsmagician could easily produce a simple 3 column csv file which the user can convert to their own GPS device format. Many free converters are available online and a report could be run of All Places Within a Distance, exported to csv and then converted for that door to door no hassle Road Trip.

The format is very simple, see below, but also note Longitude must come first.

-6.249182,54.844261, "Ballyclug Cemetery"
-6.270897,54.877792, "Ballymena Cemetery"


Google for more info, POI (points of interest) database, Garmin Tom Tom etc

We are all limited by our visions and abilities

Whilst we can borrow from the visions of others we cannot always deliver.

 

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#25 Jack

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Posted 27 January 2012 - 06:17 PM

If you split Brown Cemetery, Tyler, Davis, Texas, United States into Tyler, Davis, Texas, United States with the place details as Brown Cemetery and already have a place name of Tyler, Davis, Texas with or without the United States on the end, you will have two places named Tyler, Davis, Texas, United States.

You will probably want to merge those two places as RM doesn't automatically merge them for you.

If the focus in the Place list automatically goes back to the B's, we might easily miss that those places need to be merged. It is a lot easier to merge them as the last part of the process of splitting place and place details for one place as it would be in having to go back and find those places that need to be merged later.


The problem for me is working with a very large city where relatives are buried all over and in many different cemeteries.
Jack

a posteriori

#26 Jack

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 04:10 PM

The problem for me is working with a very large city where relatives are buried all over and in many different cemeteries.


Still a work in progress, but the ability now to work with place details in a more efficient manner has been great! As I work through those places that also contain place details, I am finding that I omitted many documents (pds, pix, etc) which I had previously entered as sources.

Killing more than 2 birds with one stone!

Thanks for the very late but very welcome update, Roots Magician!
Jack

a posteriori

#27 Kenzie

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 02:21 AM

Forgive me if this is not the right thread to post my request. It's more about Place than Place Details.

I would very much like the word "County" to appear after the county name in the place field so I don't later mistake that county for a city and try to find the county for that city. The sentence structure for a narrative also looks odd, and could be confusing to a reader unless the word "County" appears after the county name in the sentence.

There may already be a way to do this that I'm not aware of. If so, perhaps someone can tell me using small words and simple instructions *grin*. If not, perhaps a future update could add the option of placing the word "County" after the county name in the 'Edit Person' display and in the narrative sentence structure.
My default format has been: Effingham, Effingham County, IL

For example, Effingham, Effingham County, IL is clearer and means more to me than Effingham, Effingham, Illinois, USA

--
Just to insure that something is on topic ...
I, too, would like the capability of sorting place names with a reverse place name option. I really like the mock up that Vyger posted in the 18 January 2012 msg. (#5).

#28 Jerry Bryan

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 05:28 PM

I would very much like the word "County" to appear after the county name in the place field so I don't later mistake that county for a city and try to find the county for that city. The sentence structure for a narrative also looks odd, and could be confusing to a reader unless the word "County" appears after the county name in the sentence.

Type in the entire place name into the Place field, just exactly the way you want it to look - including the word County or Parish as appropriate. However, if you choose to do so (and many people do, including myself!) you will have to turn off County Check.

For the places you have already entered without the word County or Parish, the easiest place to fix them is in the Place List. Edit each place that needs to have the word County or Parish added. If a place were used for 100 different facts, changing it one time in the Place List will change it for all 100 facts.

Jerry

#29 APerson

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Posted 14 March 2012 - 11:59 PM

Type in the entire place name into the Place field, just exactly the way you want it to look - including the word County or Parish as appropriate. However, if you choose to do so (and many people do, including myself!) you will have to turn off County Check.

For the places you have already entered without the word County or Parish, the easiest place to fix them is in the Place List. Edit each place that needs to have the word County or Parish added. If a place were used for 100 different facts, changing it one time in the Place List will change it for all 100 facts.

Jerry


It would be very nice if County Check recognized the word "County".

#30 Renee Zamora

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Posted 15 March 2012 - 10:41 AM

It would be very nice if County Check recognized the word "County".

Confirming enhancement request is in our tracking system.
Renee
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#31 Renee Zamora

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Posted 15 March 2012 - 10:57 AM

I have decided to unpin this forum thread, due to update 5.0.2 & 5.0.2.1 changes. There are some outstanding requested items and they are still in our tracking system.
Renee
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#32 Vyger

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:38 PM

I have been using the NEW Place Details SPLIT utility from within RM and I have to say, IMO, it works a treat.

So credit whare credit is due to the Rootsmagician & Team for a utility which was much needed and very welcome.

Of course ;) I have to add that I hope this is not the end on Place & Place Details management & reporting enhancements.

We are all limited by our visions and abilities

Whilst we can borrow from the visions of others we cannot always deliver.

 

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#33 Vyger

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 10:29 PM

Firstly I have to say that I have been working for several hours on splitting and merging Place Details and it works faultlessly, good job and great steps forward by the Rootsmagician in this area.

However, one little missing functionality I do notice is where a Place Detail is found to be attached to the wrong Place, currently there is no way to reassign it.

I don’t believe unlinking and leaving the Place Detail as an orphan is possible so the only option when a Place Detail is under Edit is to allow the selection of an alternate (correct) Place.

The addition of such functionality and a Print button to report where a Place Detail is used would make this a pretty workable solution to the management shortcomings.

We are all limited by our visions and abilities

Whilst we can borrow from the visions of others we cannot always deliver.

 

User of Family Historian 6.2.7, Rootsmagic 7.6.0, Family Tree Maker 2014 & Legacy 7.5

 

Excel to Gedcom conversion - simple getting started tutorials here

 

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#34 Renee Zamora

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 05:20 PM

Confirming enhancement request is in our tracking system.

One question on the report for Place Detail. It does show up in the Place List when you check the Place Detail option. Is there something else you were looking for?
Renee
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#35 Vyger

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 05:43 PM

One question on the report for Place Detail. It does show up in the Place List when you check the Place Detail option. Is there something else you were looking for?


Renee, same type of Print button as does appear on the Place List but a finer brush so to speak. If you check the "Place Details" when printing the Place List the report will print all events for that Place, BELFAST for example and every event in every Street, Cemetery, Hospital and Church within BELFAST, 24 pages in my case for this example.

If I have highlighted the City Cemetery or First Presbyterian Church of BELFAST in the Edit Place Details list, I would like such a print button to give the options to "Print Events in the highlighted Place" and "Print Events Near a Place" with the follow on radius selection.

Therefore in the examples above I would only see events which took place in either the City Cemetery or First Presbyterian Church of BELFAST rather that every event in BELFAST.

I hope my request is clear, if not just let me know. :)

We are all limited by our visions and abilities

Whilst we can borrow from the visions of others we cannot always deliver.

 

User of Family Historian 6.2.7, Rootsmagic 7.6.0, Family Tree Maker 2014 & Legacy 7.5

 

Excel to Gedcom conversion - simple getting started tutorials here

 

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#36 Renee Zamora

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Posted 13 July 2012 - 08:34 AM

Thanks, I now have that added to the enhancement request.
Renee
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#37 snowathlete

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 03:12 PM

"Split Place / Details" - this functionality is one of the best I've seen in any genealogy program it has just saved me about a squillion years of work doing the job manually.
The most frustrating thing is that annoying programs like Ancestry's Family Tree Maker mean that users who send me their gedcoms have both the place and its details in one field and it is sooooo annoying. Being able to fix that relatively quickly is brilliant. Well done Rootsmagician!

Just one question, when you split a place and details about, the place detail gets moved to the correct field in the persons record that it is associated with, but if i then merge the Place with a duplicate entry (of which there may be several), i presume that the place details all become children of the single parent place that remains, and that being the case i presume that the correct place detail entry is still associated with the correct person records for each child place detail. Is that right?

#38 Vyger

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 03:52 PM

Being able to fix that relatively quickly is brilliant. Well done Rootsmagician!


Well said, credit where credit is due. ;)

Regarding your question your assumption is correct and I am not aware of any problems, hopefully better reporting of these Place Details will not be too far away.

We are all limited by our visions and abilities

Whilst we can borrow from the visions of others we cannot always deliver.

 

User of Family Historian 6.2.7, Rootsmagic 7.6.0, Family Tree Maker 2014 & Legacy 7.5

 

Excel to Gedcom conversion - simple getting started tutorials here

 

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#39 Nettie

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 03:52 PM

Do a print from the Place list for the location to see what really happened.

Genealogy:
"I work on genealogy only on days that end in "Y"." [Grin!!!]
from www.GenealogyDaily.com.
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#40 Serenity20061

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 05:37 PM

I am a newbie to RM6 and have very limited understanding of genealogy programming so these may be completely outside the program or the capabilities of future upgrades (or features that are there, but I haven't found yet), but I will list the things I want to be able to do with the program to fit with the way I find information at research locations:

1. All of the archives and libraries I have ever visited have the information organized in hierarchical order (i.e. go to US section > Iowa Records > Country Records > Township/Town > Cemetery). Is there a way to sort the places list in that order so that I can expand or narrow my list of places based on the collection of records I am viewing at a particular location?

2. If I am at looking at Cook Co, Illinois birth records and have John Smith born in Chicago, Cook Co, Illinois, USA and his brother as James Smith born in Cook Co, Illinois, USA - can I click on Cook Co, Illinois and see both of them in the same list? Is the larger geographic area include the individuals in subordinate divisions?

3. Is there a way to manually parse the location list by country > state > country > township > city > point of interest? For Enland records, this is different so perhaps a way to select a division type from a drop-down then complete the field next to it? When I run reports or queries it is hard to get accurate lists when the locations are all merged into one field. This is particularly true when the city, township, county, and/or state all have the same name or the state has changed over time. For instance have tried running a query looking for people located in the state of "Washington". I just haven't found a way to structure a search that doesn't pick up every town, township, county, state, or DC without losing some of the people actually located in the state of Washington. Way back in the earliest genealogy programs they had this feature, did it go away completely when geo-coding and mapping came into play? Are the two systems mutually exclusive?

4. Is there a way to view the list of people in my database associated with a particular location within the place list window?.

5. Is there a way to view the "To Do" items that I have associated with a place from the places list? I often "pop in" to local museums, historical societies, or libraries to see what records they have that can't be found anywhere else. Many times, these "quick stops" are when I am en route to somewhere else and don't have time to delve into the stacks. I like the feature in RM6 that lets me add a place or repository not associated with an indiviudal and add notes. I also like the ability to add a "To Do" item to a place so I can make a quick list of records that I will want to revisit in more depth at that location. The problem I am having is being able to click on a location or generate a location report that will include the "To Do" list associated with the place. (It may be that I need to do this another way and haven't yet found it in the help menu instructions.)

6. I saw in an earlier post that there was a request to include "Co." in the place names for counties and still use the county checker. I think that was before RM6 came out. Did that feature get included? I am still having difficulty getting county checker to recognize locations with "Co." included in the place name. It also won't recognize township names within counties (the way most of my census records are documented) either. I really don't want to remove "Twp" or "Co" in the place names because this is the only way I can distinguish them from other portions of the location in the list - particularly where the location is a township or county is a historic name.

7. What is the best way to note a historic name of a place and then match it up with the current location where records might be searched? Historic place names have always been a bit of a challenge and I want to make sure I use RM6 in a way that will take the best advantage of the software capabilities for documenting these locations. For instance how do you document places such as "The Republic of Texas" as opposed to the state of Texas; or "The State of Franklin" which is now part of Tennessee and Virginia, or Louisiana when it was part of France?. Does the country checker include locations prior to the date the location became part of a state or part of the country?) I also have some Arcadian ancestors, so suggestions about Canadian locations would help too.

8. Prior to the adoption of surnames, many of my ancestors had names such as 'George the butcher of Appleby". I am always at a loss as to how to record these individuals in my tree. Do I put "George" in the Given Name field with no surname, "butcher" as an occupation event, and "Appleby" as the possible location of birth or residence? I have an overabundance of people with George, John, James, and Edward as first names and no surnames. Many of the locations are old castle or keep names and are in countries that are no longer in existence or the country has changed numerous times over the centuries. What is the best way to document these places and people in RM6 and be able to find them in the long list of people with the same given name, no surname, on only the location identifier as a means of distinguishing them from one another. (One branch is George son of George for eight generations and every single child of named at least one of their children George and they all lived in the same region of England for at least 200 years).

I really loved the "moch up" that was attached to the first post in this thread. I only have a few suggestions I would add to your moch up: (1) an icon for people associated with the location and ability to "Go To" a particular person in that list; and (2) an icon for tasks associated with the location with similar ability to "Go To" the task.

Thank you for any suggestions you can provide.